I'm on my way home... I see a blue 7th Gen Celi GT on I-75... So I'm just cruising and I notice it's a young guy and the Celi has a little body kit. So I'm thinking, "let me just see how much that car can beat me by". So I pull up even next to him. Three honks. Beep, beep, beep. GO. I had the guy the whole time, pretty much... He kept up with me for like a second. Mind you I have an automatic ST. WTF just happened??? I thought the new Celis were faster! This is a true story and apparently this guy does not know how to drive. I mean, he honked thrice so this was a race. Maybe he was messing with me? What happened? Lol.

lol, well from what i gather the ST celica can beat down the celica GT (00+ models of course) i dunno, i havent had ne problems from ne n/a gt's yet.

Its 140hp.

If the GT was an auto I could maybe believe it, but I don't think an ST could beat a 5spd GT. I can take 7th gen auto GTs no problem but the 5spds are more trouble.

I dint do too bad myself with my manual ST vs a GT but we where just toying with eachother not a strait race but when we both hit it we where about even.

I have trouble with GT-S's, GT's have never been a problem, but for and auto ST he had to have been messing with you.

That's what I was thinking, but if he did decide to really hit it, I have an extra 75HP behing my seat... just in case >>

I ran a couple of GSR's today, one had a VTEC badge and the other had a Honda emblem on it, it was funny the one with the VTEC badge almost took out a median trying to get in the turn lane, I eventually lost the other one, what is it with Honda guys and flat black?

GSRs and GT-Ss will just own the ****ta outta GTs let alone STs enough with this BS.

i've beat'n a GT 7th gen
with an manual st

ok the kid driving the 7th gen GT didn't know what he was doing or wasn't racing ... i have had a fully stock 7gc GT take me by a good 3 car lenth .. they girl driving it was just as good of a driver as me... and trust me i know how to drive and get everything out of my car...

macavely, im sorry to say but either that car was hooked up or you really cant drive as good as that girl. i mean, from what i gather, you have a gt. 135 horses. i know thats not everything, but its good enough for this topic. i have 110, and i didnt spray nitrous. so i beat this guy by a good half a car. i dont know how that girl beat you by three cars if she was stock... i dont know if this guys car was stock, but he had the action package so it had the trd bodykit thing. i dont mean to offend you by what i said about your driving. im sure youve been driving for a long time and know what youre doing, it just sounded like you were saying my story wasnt true or something. i mean, i know this was a race for sure, the guy honked three times and we were off. that little 1zz was really kicking. i took my overdrive off, as i do for every race... i dont know if that does much. so i dont know. my st is pretty much stock, just intake, diff spark plugs, lol, and nitrous which i didnt use. so your gt probably had three of the spark plug wires disattached when you raced the 7th gen. thats the only thing i could think of... >>

-JoKeRkId613+Jun 12, 2005 - 9:45 PM

Maybe my driving isn't that good ... and yea she is a damn good driver.. but i alse know that 7th gen GT is fast maybe not off the line.. but faster then a 6gc GT and ST ... from point A to B and around corners.... if the person behined the wheel knows how to drive.. and before i owned my GT i had and ST auto tranny.... so i know how damn slow that thing is... so u taking a 7th gen ... well the other kid just didn't know how to drive ... i belive u took him...but there is a reason behined it and its not that ur auto ST is faster then a GT ...

-Supersprynt+Jun 12, 2005 - 4:45 PM

Dude, I wasn't BSing, I didn't say I busted them I just beat them and they were beaters, the GS-T I have trouble with stock, you give low torque cars too much credit, torque makes better for playing on the highway anyways.
BTW I think i've explained that i'm not stock, I need to update my profile.

This post has been edited by darksecret: Jun 13, 2005 - 8:42 AM

I think he has you there Mac a stock 7th gen GT beating a stock 6th Gen GT, thats like getting beat by a stock D16 Civic, if that happened to me then I would be checking to see if one of my cylinders is even firing (no B/S it's happened before, I ran a D16 Civic and won by a car length because my #1 was giving a really weak spark, explained my starting problem also, it was the plug wire) I'm going to have to get some video of this stuff, they won't have sound since all I have is a Camera with an XD card but it shoots 1 min. clips, and all I need is 16 or so seconds.

-darksecret+Jun 13, 2005 - 1:30 PM
And you don't give them enough credit. Torque makes a car easier to drive, but horsepower is what keeps a car moving at higher speeds. If you wanna talk torque... you better have a sh!t load cause a majority of engine's torque bands are below 4000 rpms. Try shifting at peak torque during a race and then try doing it at peak horsepower... you'll see who's faster.

Anyway... if you have an AUTO ST... you shouldn't be trying to race it anyway.

I agree auto ST needs help, I really need a video of this stuff, when you're comparing about 128 whp 156 lbs. ft (well that was a couple of years ago when the previous owner had it, not much has changed since, just an intake) to maybe 145 whp 95 lbs. ft. with about a 200 lbs. weight difference yeah I would say I have enough power to hang with any Honda less than a Prelude VTEC. I figured I would get my a** handed to me when I first ran a '98 Si on I485, I figured I did pretty good seeing he had at least an intake and exhaust, I also learned that the KA20 powered Si's are slow I ran right beside one on I77 and I was in 5th the entire time, the main reason people get beat when they push there Celicas to the redline is that any amount of real power was lost about 1,500 rpm back and now they're wasting speed when they could upshift at about 5,000 and take advantage of the powerband, just because a car has a 9,000 rpm redline doesn't mean it has a lot of power.

This post has been edited by darksecret: Jun 13, 2005 - 9:50 AM

-darksecret+Jun 13, 2005 - 2:49 PM

Wow a prelude vtec is slow, they are heavy and slow.

Everyone on this board with the exception of the gt-four, the ssi, ssii, ssiii, turbo'd and the 3s guys need to face it your cars are slow. Stock for stock a gt or an st is not going to beat a 7th get gt or gt-s with someone that is actually racing you and knows how to drive, let alone a civic si, the 2k si's have like 165 hp and they are geared great, they are quick little cars. The GT and ST are 16 and 17 second cars, that is not fast.

97+ Prelude VTEC, only Hondas I know of that are faster is the RSX-S, S2000, NSX. There are other versions of these cars but that's pretty much it. Check the specs of the K20A3 Si, it's a 16 second car also (with a top speed of 118 I think), 16.0 flat based on professional driver facts so 16.5-16.8 with an amatuer. Yeah they are heavy but they aren't really that slow, faster than a Celica GT-S.

This post has been edited by darksecret: Jun 13, 2005 - 5:59 PM

ive beat a 7gc gt-s >>

I bet you have, no seriously it wouldn't suprise me with a turbo.

-darksecret+Jun 13, 2005 - 4:43 PM

A 99 prelude has a 1/4 mile time of 15.4, the 99 civic si has a 1/4 mile time of 15.7 both are faster than celica gt's or st's. The integra type-r which is an acura really a honda does the 1/4 mile in 14.7 stock. A 2000 celica gts has a 1/4 mile time of 15.2s. I couldn't find the 7th gen GT's numbers but I'm guessing its better than 16s.

Where have you got your times, if it's that site with the huge list of cars and times it's wrong info, I tried to use that place before and it's bogus, go with Car and Driver or Road and Track it's funny that the new KA20 Si is considered faster yet it has slower times than the previous models, a lot of places have wrong info or guesses it's funny how it only takes the GT-S 15.4 to do the quarter yet half that time it's trying to climb a mere 30 mph.

-forkee+Jun 13, 2005 - 10:44 AM

I wonder why?... Lol. Nice bro, that guy must've had his mouth wide open. good s h i t. i totally agree the 6g auto st celis are slow as hell. lol. i cant wait to get my 4agze. coming this summer, hopefully. but yea, i dont know. that guy either let me win or he REALLY couldn't drive. either way, if he was driving well, i would've sprayed that 75 and im pretty sure i woulda had that >> nitrous is the s h i t!

Since i'm the one holding the camera (explains why it looks like crap) I couldn't shift so I had to keep it in fifth (which isn't a bad thing after 80 but isn't great at 60) and i don't give any gas until I start shooting so it's from a coast so I go from 60-90 in about 10 seconds from a fifth gear roll, so what is that like 7-8 seconds in fourth, funny thing is the fastest quarter mile times on the few you said was the GT-S (ex. the Type-R, i've never had the pleasure to run one) funny thing is even with a 6 speed almost half that quarter is from 60-90 which is roughly 7-8 seconds, basically that means if a Celica GT-S was to pass me flooring it at 60 and I was cruising in fourth at 60 mph I could floor it and keep up, so basically like I said i'm not king ding-a-ling but I can hold my own with an Si and not much less than a GT-S. If you can see in the video I can handle curves pretty well also, this is the one the AMG about lost it on, ask easternpiro1 he's followed me on it and it's sharper than it looks, I would love to see a stock Si hang with me on it.

BTW like I said before this was done a few months ago and all I was doing was trying to see is if I could film and drive at the same time, if I can concentrate on the driving more I might have given it WOT. I'll try to do another if I can find a passenger to film me.

S-Turn

7.8Mb so it's a slow download and I wish I had sound but this was done on just a 16MB Camera.

-darksecret+Jun 13, 2005 - 4:43 PM
You should pay a visit to EPhatch.com. One of my local buddies ran 14.9 with his A3... and when you say K20... you should specify. If you think you know well enough to say such and such Hondas are slow, you better know well enough to specify which Honda engine is which. There's a world of difference between K20A3, K20A2 and K20A...

Also... it's pretty redundant to compare a modded car vs. a stock car. If you do happen to go check out EPhatch.com (which I high reccomend you do)... you'll see how many of those "slow" Civic SI's run 14's with bolt-ons and mild tuning.

As for the H22A ludes... they're not that fast. The H22A is a great motor, but the ludes themselves are pretty heavy (~3000 pounds). I'd say mod for mod, an Integra GSR can outrun an H22 Lude.

Oh... and I really hate people who talk trash about racing and stuff... especially when they just don't know too much, nor have too much experience with different types of cars/engines.

I'm comparing a modded econo engine (that nobody gives credit since nobody tries to really mod it) to a stock performance engine. My bad I said KA20 didn't I i've been talking about 240's a lot lately, to get technical (since the only person it bothers is Kwanza) K20A3, K20A is the Civic Type R right and the K20A2 is the RSX-S, I said Civic Si though, not Type R or RSX Type S. You're right about the Prelude I went off of the numbers since i've only seen one willing to race and I know he would beat me I don't have first hand experience. I figured you of all people would know that knowledge of motors has nothing to do with driving, look at Nascar that stuff looks easy but they don't have the electronic "driving assistants" that other forms of racing have and you can't find too many Nascar guys that can tell you what a 350 is. Also consider this i'm no Honda expert I go off what I race I know enough about Hondas to know which one I can try and which I need to stay away from, if the Si's are so quick you guys got some bad reps because if an Si w/ intake and exhaust can't beat a weak little Celica with some cams, intake, and exhaust Honda Hell must be freezing over.

This post has been edited by darksecret: Jun 13, 2005 - 6:14 PM

-darksecret+Jun 13, 2005 - 10:58 PM
It's not a matter of giving credit... you're comparing apples and oranges based on remote accounts. On average, 6th gen Celicas are 17 second cars between modded GT's and ST's. On average, modded 7th gen GT's and GT-S's are 14-15 second cars. On average, modded EP3 Civic SI's are 14-15 second cars. On average, modded Integra GSR's are 14-15 second cars. 1 second is as much as 2-3 car lengths in the 14-18 second range on the 1/4 mile.

I call it bragging when you run across some random car on the street, pass it, and then go off on how slow they are and such, and how much credit your econo-box engine deserves. If you look at other tuner communities and look at their relative averages, perhaps then you can start to make a guess what would really happen if these two cars really raced. Bench racing based on remote guesses and then bragging about it bugs me...

Also... since we're talking drag racing... it doesn't take much skill, and since it's bench racing, let's assume the drivers are all equal. If you're trying to compare drivers, not engines, a pinto can smoke a ferrai if the driver's a monkey. That makes as much sense as trying to compare drivers you don't know anything about.

If you want to put it that way then Kwanza, what about an SS-II vs. the K20A3 Civic Si, see I could compare apples to apples but this is america, Toyota lucked out on the good stuff, but if I did a 3SGE swap and started busting all the little Si kids around here they would be crying because i'm not stock, well in most other parts of the world that is what came in my car, I didn't upgrade from a B16 to a B18, I went from a Camry motor back to what was meant to be in this car. So now that I gave myself the right to argue due to being stuck with a motor made for another car, unlike Honda kids who get a decent choice. See I only bench raced one car and that was the Prelude since i've never ran one (97+) and the only one i've driven was an '89 Si, the guy I ran with the '04 Si knew what he was doing he ran a lot, and it felt pretty good to have someone with a car that is suppose to be Oogled over by Honda nuts in the US swear that i'm not stock, and as I told him there is a little done, there was no B/S there is a little done to my car, like a few hundred in mods. It just tires me of all these Honda guys getting on here and claiming that a friggin RSX-S can beat a GT-Four, maybe an old beater Four if the front wheels fell off but that's about it.

-Rjb23+Jun 13, 2005 - 11:22 AM

A SS-I is slow. Very slow.