Working along side with Jamie at CW Racing to develop a proper front splitter. (Not a front lip)
Universal for all cars as long as the front end if flat. (This can be achieved with a front lip added on)
This is what we've come up with so far.
Opinions pls?

2pc design possibly?? or even a 4pc in either C/F or Alum

i like it..everytime i save, i could never save enough for your products

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^ That! LOL! looks great though.

Looks great!
Would love to see it made and fitted

Does it come under the car so that it's not visible or does it gonna stick out under the front bumper.

1.Tigawoods
lol

but that looks pretty sound so far!
you know im down for one when its out

I understand the 2 outer most channels, but the rest of them are not clear to me.

having those channels at any angle other than 0 degrees will create more turbulance under the car, the channels should serve as a guide for the air to escape the underbody of the car faster, not aimed to hit the underbody, so a flat underbody with a REAR diffuser is the " most " effective way.

^ this is how I understand this works, not an attack to your concept, just trying to get some acknowlegde as how this is suppose to work and why.

This post has been edited by Culpable04: Sep 6, 2011 - 9:34 AM

Culp is right having those angles underneath the car will actually cause lift. Also the 2 on the outers are pushing air towards the tire and you want to push air away from the tire.
(Will only work at high rate of speed and if air can even make it to the channels)
If you moved the outer channels inside angle to the mid point of the tire and angled the inner two towards the brakes or change the angle 360 so the ducks push cool air into the engine bay(as long as the road temp is cooler the ambient air)

BUT on most of our cars it wont even matter because for the most part the cars dont see speeds for this to be effective or not.
P.S. If hydroplaning those outer channels would push more water under the tire at high rates of speed.

This post has been edited by hatchy_gt-s: Sep 6, 2011 - 7:37 PM

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It will stick out front he bumper by about 2 inches yes.
Splitter rods will be included in the kit too.

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Understood. The idea is that the splitter sits lower than the mid section so by having a slope it helps increase the air flow speed up as it passes.
We've done a few more simulations to test this logic. I'll post it up later on.

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I see your point. The idea on the two on the wheels are quite similar to the two main at the rear. Typically a pain splitter is totally flat. The same air passes under directly in front the the tyres are the same volume when hitting the tyres.
Many new cars divert the air by putting a flat panel rite in front of the wheel face. This works by diverting the air away from the wheels but as a result, causes much more turbulence and more drag. So the idea is instead of diverting it down or to the side, the same about out air is directed up and over. The rotation of the wheels push the air out anyway.

here's a mini write up from CW racing after various simulations from everyone's input.



Design 1. simply a flat plate. Produced
some down force. Would be the most easy
to produce and fit.
Design

Design 2. similar to design 1 but with an
angled tail. Produced approximately 2x the
down force of design 1 and with the benefit
of drag being reduced by 1/2.

Design 3. a very complicated design which
was influenced by comments from members
on forums. The piece would be very
complicated to make and mount due to its
shape. It does however produce over 4x
the down force of design 1. negative point
though is it also produces 3x the drag.

Design 4. a design that id a hybrid of design
1 & 3. not the simplest to make but much
easier than design 3 and should be simpler
to fit. It produces 3x the down force of design
1 and only a fraction more drag.



Design 1. CFD shows quite simple flow due to its
simple design. The swirly bit behind the wheel is the
wake from the tyre.

Design 2. bit more going on. More lower pressure
under the car as there is much more blue. Also
selected flow lines through the rotating wheel. You
can see how the wheel pumps the air out like a jet.

Design 3. lots of 3d flow on this one. You can still
see the swirly bit behind the wheel. Also areas
where the flow separates away from the strakes
in the channel. Also an area in front of the tyre.

Design 4. Lots more laminar flow. Still with the
wake behind the wheel.

as expected, the most improvement seems to come from the second one, in order to fully see the effectiveness of it, you need to check for the flow out the back, assign a " standard" diffuser and by keeping said diffuer on the rear standard and only changing between splitters you can see which one has the best flow under the car. I still think a flat spliiter or underbody will be the best here, the 2 outer channels if aimed properly can also be of huge help, instead of having air strike the tires, you can diffuse it to either the side right before the tire or aim it to the brakes.

if you focus on the colors of the flow, you can see how in the rest of them the pressure is low at the splitter but increases as soon as it gets released from it, that's not ideal, you really want a panel that will lower the pressure and release it at the same pressure, because the air still has a long way to go before is release out the back.

this is great technology you have access to, and is nice to see someone using this kind of design for parts, instead of just throwing something together that looks nice but doesn't really perform as it should. I know your prices are not the friendliest around, but if this gets produced and properly, I will be in your list of customers as it will worth every pennie.

Can't say it any better than Culp .
Id like to see the charts of the full, rear diffuser+ front splitter/flow
id be very interested in picking it up

Thanks culp. You have highlighted some very important. Issues here regarding where and when to release the air. Very much appreciated. The credits should really go to jamie at cw racing. We are merely honoured to bring a vision into production.

Culp I've been thinking about your point and I guess we should ask what are we trying to achieve here?
I totally agree that for the most effective outcome is to have the air diffuse at some point at the back of the car or out the sides.
At the same time I need to go back to my main objective which is to design and make an effective front splitter.
These designs where to do just that as a stand alone unit and the objective is to make it actually work and not to look pretty like most splitters out there.
If to say the objective was to make a race car with a full under belly and rear diffuser then design 1 will be the best choice.
But I think many track users would mainly buy just a front splitter on it's own and maybe a rear diffuser as extra.
Aside from that, there isn't really a product out there such a a full under belly add on to complete the full set as well secondly not all cars are suited to have a totally flat underside.

So going back to our main objective, I would personally go for option 4 as it's the most effective front splitter add on as a universal part.

This post has been edited by yellowchinaman: Sep 7, 2011 - 3:23 PM

want one

What Culp is trying to say is you want the windage lines nice and strait with an even low pressure level, like in #2. When you look at #'s 3&4 you see lots of changing force, its uneven pressure changes, the swirls behind the tires all cause small amounts of up force when it reaches the back. I will pay the price for something this nice!

P.S. You could try fins like what you have on the back to channel air aposed to gallies.

This post has been edited by hatchy_gt-s: Sep 7, 2011 - 8:54 PM

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Very good point. Fins we can do easily. I'll have a look at what a simulation will show.

This post has been edited by yellowchinaman: Sep 8, 2011 - 5:41 AM

Guys, as much as we might not have much aftermarket support here for Celicas, I must say it's fantastic that somebody is developing a modification such as this for our lowly imports. Granted, this is mostly done for ST205s, but I'm sure these will find an application here. Fantastic work Ray.

This post has been edited by SwissFerdi: Sep 8, 2011 - 8:39 AM

I'd be interested in this.

While your at it yellowchinaman, can you get a trd and SS-III wing on your gt4 and see which one provides better downforce?!

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The idea is to make this universal for other cars not just for GT4's so this will work for st202's as well. You just need to have a lip so the front is flat.

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You mean the difference between GT4 blocks and Euro blocks on a 2 post wing?

no Difference between 2 Post Spoiler GT4 Riser Blocks vs TRD Spoiler. And if you have a roof spoiler throw that thing on your car also.

How about the wind drag at the front of the car with the stock gt-4 bumper and c-one lip.

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+1

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I may have this done later in future as it cost us time and money to have a mock up model made and run a simulation over night.

Meanwhile back to this topic. We're in the process of making a prototype now.

Will having a 3" downpipe interfere with the fitment?

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from the ST205? no. I have a 3" DP and it doesn't drop beyond the subframe.

What speeds are we talking about to get the benefit of these splitters?

^ Dang dude, you still post! It's only a handful of us OGs left. You're like one of the very first people I ever read on an automotive forum in my life. I was very naive back then, lol. Back on topic, any updates?

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Awesome. I'll subscribe to this topic. I love your stuff.

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Very critical . fluid mechanics will tell you that laminar flow is impossible at semi large speeds. laminar only happens at slow velocities. I don't know why everyone is obsessed about laminar flow because it won't happen anyway. What is of large concern however are the spinning vortexes of air at the back. These are called eddy currents and its the reason that tractor trailers and large trucks will buffet your car on the highway. Very high drag associated with those.
I would be down for any of these designs that reduce drag and increase DF. aka #2.
my .02