My idea is this bear with me before just calling me stupid or saying it cannot be done or that I am plain dreaming.

Get this

add this




racing springs



get yamaha to make this top for the 3S



Slap this on with this




This to control the power



This with a 6spd and this





This for stable running in rally mode



This surge tank



W2A intercooler

Put all that into this



Put this in that



And help that thing get a hood like this






Now my thinking is this...IF somehow I can acquire an FT-86 shell, Create a 5th Gen 3S-GTE that has VVT-i with 400HP capable, slap on Superstruts and 4WD (New WRC rules stat that computers can not control AWD anymore so that the driver actually does some driving) and Test this thing in the Paraguayan Chaco rally (which trust me Is dry nasty and tough enough to test for problems, Dakar wants 4 million dollars from the government to pass thru there lol) I Want to talk to Toyota to release this FT-86 as the Fifth GT-FOUR (165,185,205,246,286??) make 2,500 units with a special Rallye Type N badge (Honda's got Type R why not have type N?) I think maybe just maybe We could jump start toyota back into rallying or atleast selling decent cars meant for rallying, get that much needed VVTi on a great engine which can be sold as sets like hot bread in the racing market (who wouldn't want a fully built VVT-i forged 400hp Beast)

dilemma would be how the hell to get an FT-86 shell and how to get yamaha to make me a VVT-i valvetrain for the 3S


Brainstorming Ideas and general flaming mode on

I'm just going to leave this right here:




And i do apreciate your want to have TRD back in the game, and as a serious player. The mounting would have to be all custom as the FT-86 is with a boxter engine, right? It could be done though.

Your biggest issue is obviously funds. and i'm pretty sure no amount of petitioning would get the capitol raised. Nice concept on a concept car's redesigned concept though.

ultimately there are bigger and badder engines out there than the 3s- that's the biggest point of fail IMHO. I'd honestly like to see Toyota bring something new and quite heavy to the table. Sadly though, Toyota is holding down the market on gas economy, and really riding that train hard.

I Dunno about you guys but I sure as hell would be pissed to sit in a Toyota that has a boxer engine in it...Might as well open a KKK recruitment center in harlem It just doesnt sit in right as awesome as It might be...

Bigger or badder engines might not be the point from what I have seen the 3S is tough as nails and the only **** that breaks down in it are the goddamn pistons, It would be cheaper than re designing a new engine and the funds aren't a problem


Bigger and Badder engines have to endure a this rally though and rallying is basically running the engine in an oven

This post has been edited by Neon90424: Feb 13, 2011 - 1:37 PM

Don't hate on the pancake!

What does that even mean?

>
x2

Pancake = Boxer engine.

So called because it's a flat H engine as opposed to the inline or V-bank engines.

Noobs.

PS: I'll take the 2.5L boxer in the FT-86, turbocharge it, and never look back at my 5S.

I never heard that term before. (someone spray him with the fire extinguisher please)

And i do understand the boxter engine has higher compression ratio than the 5s. So i must agree. Although it'd be a funny looking ex.manifold.

Or twice as expensive for small turbochargers....

But again, I'm really open to the idea of bringing new engines to the table; and not reviving dead dogs. No offense to the 3s comunity, But really. Anyone who's swaped an engine can apreciate the demand for a better engine. Our Celica's will always want a 3s for the power/ease of the swap.

But even celica went to ZZ engines. And that 2z has quite the big fat aggressive cam... i'm just sayin...

I have a Subaru, and I haven't even heard that one.



furthermore...

>

ummmmmmmmmmmmm what?




edit: in addition, this is a 1MZ


This post has been edited by 95CelicaST: Feb 13, 2011 - 6:19 PM

>


I can't believe i missed that. Damn, i'm off my game.

+50 Points 95celi.

This post has been edited by D-Man: Feb 13, 2011 - 6:15 PM

The As Awesome as it might be applied to the boxer engine, The ZZ engine is nice but I dont think it can take the beef of 400HP without compromising the lower end. About the cams you missed the part of asking yamaha to re do the valve train with VVT-i and I'm thinking 272 cams...

Celicas went to the ZZ engine because of its gas mileage not its performance, that engine is a joke compared to where the ST205 was going it kept climbing from 200hp to 260 with plenty of room for improvement with just injectors FPR fuel pump and beefier turbo...its like taking the new EVO 11 and putting in a 1.8 NA 200hp engine in it... a giant WTF


Im thinking this FT-86 lower center of gravity and what not is a light car...the 3S is a pretty amazing engine and in no way a dead dog to me...You keep saying its an old thing like they can put something newer in it? Like that Ford 150 comercial advertising oil squirters and vvt-i as If its goddamn state of the art... What would you change in the 3S that a newer engine has? give it 4 and a half pistons?

The celica only needed to be lighter and It would be the perfect car its only drawback has always been its weight...and its crappy headlights...THIS FT-86 with lightweight with a heavy 3s infront will give it orgasmic oversteer with 4x4 screw its low center of gravity boxer engine for what? its not even going to rally its gonna be rich kids doing light to light drag races and when this thing is like 6 years old we might be able to afford one and 3s swap it and put speed holes in it

as good as the 3sgte is, its OLD school tech. use a modern more efficient motor..i'd take a subi engine they sound t3h s3x

This post has been edited by playr158: Feb 13, 2011 - 8:07 PM

>


If you wanna try to change toyotas lineup i suggest you learn Japanese

This post has been edited by SupraKid: Feb 13, 2011 - 8:18 PM

You kids need to go drive a subaru. You'll forget about that 3s in no time.

>


You Should drive a 205, You'll laugh at the subaru later...


What makes a modern efficient motor more efficient?

You think subies sound good? ever heard 272 cams on the 3s? now thats a rev happy purr

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RCEgqJJ2Vw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysRQvDsBcUw...feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jza2_wYvfts...feature=related

Whoever willi is...his exhaust note makes me sh*t my pants

keep it coming....

This post has been edited by njccmd2002: Feb 13, 2011 - 9:01 PM

I've actually driven a 185 with a 205 swap and mods...



I'd still take the scoob. Its quicker. It sounds better. The seats are more supportive. The interior is more spacious. It has better fuel economy. Its more reliable.

I can go on for days.

>


I love my 11 WRX, but the punch the 3sgte in the Celica is huge. I really do enjoy both, and really don't think you can count the 3s out. Overall though, I feel like my WRX hatch is the better car.

This post has been edited by BLINKYxMUNKEY: Feb 13, 2011 - 9:20 PM

well 1999 vs 2011 is a lot ofcourse it will get better mileage have better seats and have more interior room with 4 doors

I see both sides of the argument. The 3S-GTE really is an old-school engine, using old technology to squeeze out hp. Today's engines all use VVT and other technology to get the same power that older motors struggled to get. The OP acknowledges that argument, then says to update the 3S-GTE using today's technology so that it isn't so outdated. However, in doing that, the 3S would no longer be a 3S. Literally every aspect of the motor would be changed. You might still have a 2 liter turbocharged engine, but it wouldn't be from the 3S series of engines.

Toyota has an image to uphold. Right now they are an eco-friendly retirement-car company. That's why if such a machine as the OP's dream was ever built, it would be badged as a Lexus.

Instead of all of this work for a 3s, why don't we take a 2gr+6sp or auto with paddles and stick that in the ft-86. Instant winner.

Maybe even make a sport trim with a trd supercharger. Cheap for toyota, fun for you and me.

This post has been edited by 95CelicaST: Feb 13, 2011 - 10:13 PM

Both sides strike some great points, im a 3s loyalist, and can not speak on any subie let alone any AWD since ive never driven one, but whats this i hear about the subie turbo boxer motor being fuel effecient?! i thought they sucked at gas mileage!

This post has been edited by easternpiro1: Feb 13, 2011 - 10:21 PM

My wrx regularly gets 25mpg. On a trip from Seattle to Bend, OR I got over 30mpg.

>



SENSE................it has been made

3.5 is not a rally engine remember people this will be used in a rally

The Subaru might be, but Toyota was banned from rally.

>

And they haven't been back since. When was the last wrc event that had a Toyota in it?

Lol toyota hasn't built anything src worthy since 1999. Woohoo. WRC Camery?! Ftl

last offici8al race was in 1999, but read, there may be some hope for us

Click here ~!


my thing has always been about taste, from your comments sounds like you really love your Subaru, and that's great, but for obvious reasons others love the 3Sgte engine, when you consider the amount of technology that car manufacturers have incorporated on their cars / engines design in the last decade, and realized that the 3SGTE is an outdated design and still performs up to the task, is just fair to give recognition and not look down on those who want some more of it.

I personally don't like Subarus as a car for me to own, but they are great cars, fast, affordable and reliable, my brother loves them and so do a lot of my friends who own them, but when they test drove my car, they were impressed but its performance and without argument a few of them agreed that my car would be faster ( we didn't race ) at the end of the day is not about who owns the best car, but who can make the best out of what it has. I get ~ 28 mpg, I drive my swapped car every single day ( 90 miles round trip ) and of course that's with occasional boost, with no reliability issues.

am I saying 3sgte is a better engine than those in STIs ? nop, but I will say that a STI engine wouldn't make me happier.