im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned
15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned
Talk about cheaply turbo-ing a 5sfe - 6G Celicas Forums
15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned
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i dont think we are debating the actual eturbos for sale. im sorry, but whoever buys these is wasting there money. the one i saw for sale advertised 2.2amps. ya thats not even 30 watts, obviously its not going to have anywhere near the power needed to create boost. the product also advertised it can flow 250 cfm. another pointless fact and misleading advertising, even though my 7a only flows 191 cfm at 6000rpm, there is still no way that a 30 watt motor can sustain a significant pressure gradient without it stalling. flowing 250 cfm is pointless at a low pressure gradient, flowing 250cfm at any significant boost level requires significant power. there claims of 10-25hp gains are also laughable. however, like ive said, overall idea is still possible.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 9, 2006 - 5:15 PM
QUOTE(lagos @ Feb 9, 2006 - 2:28 PM) [snapback]391385[/snapback]
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im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
i dont think we are debating the actual eturbos for sale. im sorry, but whoever buys these is wasting there money. the one i saw for sale advertised 2.2amps. ya thats not even 30 watts, obviously its not going to have anywhere near the power needed to create boost. the product also advertised it can flow 250 cfm. another pointless fact and misleading advertising, even though my 7a only flows 191 cfm at 6000rpm, there is still no way that a 30 watt motor can sustain a significant pressure gradient without it stalling. flowing 250 cfm is pointless at a low pressure gradient, flowing 250cfm at any significant boost level requires significant power. there claims of 10-25hp gains are also laughable. however, like ive said, overall idea is still possible.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 9, 2006 - 5:15 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
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Me too, but probably for different reasons.
CelicaST, you who I'm talking about when I say, "if the right person decided to make a e-turbo." Have you considered running a separate alternator hooked to its own battery to supply power? If you could get a belt system working with the turning of the fan, you could run multiple electric motors on it. This would probably be more complicated than making a supercharger, but it would prove a point. Any time you have innovations there are always very reputable skeptics. Skeptics are very important to the advancement of science. They make it so we have to prove everything thoroughly. I deal with them on a daily basis. After dealing with them for so long, it's almost irritating to see the things people say with no proof. People can say and believe anything they want, but the only thing that real is things that are proven. Weather its skeptics or researcher. If the skeptics say this is wrong, I challenge them experiment and prove it is false. If nothing else, provide scientific evidence to back up your theory. The science to this is simple. How much air can an electronically driven fan push? If it's more than a car can take in, it will pressurize. The practicality is the only thing in question in my mind. That is what you are for CelicaST. Please prove this one way or the other.
QUOTE(lagos @ Feb 9, 2006 - 4:28 PM) [snapback]391385[/snapback]
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im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
Me too, but probably for different reasons.
CelicaST, you who I'm talking about when I say, "if the right person decided to make a e-turbo." Have you considered running a separate alternator hooked to its own battery to supply power? If you could get a belt system working with the turning of the fan, you could run multiple electric motors on it. This would probably be more complicated than making a supercharger, but it would prove a point. Any time you have innovations there are always very reputable skeptics. Skeptics are very important to the advancement of science. They make it so we have to prove everything thoroughly. I deal with them on a daily basis. After dealing with them for so long, it's almost irritating to see the things people say with no proof. People can say and believe anything they want, but the only thing that real is things that are proven. Weather its skeptics or researcher. If the skeptics say this is wrong, I challenge them experiment and prove it is false. If nothing else, provide scientific evidence to back up your theory. The science to this is simple. How much air can an electronically driven fan push? If it's more than a car can take in, it will pressurize. The practicality is the only thing in question in my mind. That is what you are for CelicaST. Please prove this one way or the other.
Live Free, Be Happy
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well thank you. "Have you considered running a separate alternator hooked to its own battery to supply power? If you could get a belt system working with the turning of the fan, you could run multiple electric motors on it." sorry i dont understand the benefit or what you mean by either of those two ideas
and both sound to complicated to the point where it would be more difficult to install than a typical setup. main benefit of such a electronic setup would be installation ease. well when im a senior i hope to, but first i would have to get this project approved by the ME department. sounds like they would since it involves thermodynamics, electronics, fluid dynamics, and pretty much anything else i could think of.
oh and this statement "How much air can an electronically driven fan push? If it's more than a car can take in, it will pressurize." is true, however, it will only produce a pressure gradient that the motor can sustain, aka high pressure gradient=high power. a tiny weak motor might pump a lot of air say in open air but once the outlet pressure rises in relation to the inlet pressure, it becomes harder for that motor to pump air in. IN CONCLUSION, dont buy an eturbo! they are scams and a complete waste of money.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 9, 2006 - 5:08 PM
QUOTE(Bigmeanbulldog55 @ Feb 9, 2006 - 2:41 PM) [snapback]391393[/snapback]
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Me too, but probably for different reasons.
CelicaST, you who I'm talking about when I say, "if the right person decided to make a e-turbo." Have you considered running a separate alternator hooked to its own battery to supply power? If you could get a belt system working with the turning of the fan, you could run multiple electric motors on it. This would probably be more complicated than making a supercharger, but it would prove a point. Any time you have innovations there are always very reputable skeptics. Skeptics are very important to the advancement of science. They make it so we have to prove everything thoroughly. I deal with them on a daily basis. After dealing with them for so long, it's almost irritating to see the things people say with no proof. People can say and believe anything they want, but the only thing that real is things that are proven. Weather its skeptics or researcher. If the skeptics say this is wrong, I challenge them experiment and prove it is false. If nothing else, provide scientific evidence to back up your theory. The science to this is simple. How much air can an electronically driven fan push? If it's more than a car can take in, it will pressurize. The practicality is the only thing in question in my mind. That is what you are for CelicaST. Please prove this one way or the other.
>
QUOTE(lagos @ Feb 9, 2006 - 4:28 PM) [snapback]391385[/snapback]
>
im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
im amazed there is even a debate about these things..lol
Me too, but probably for different reasons.
CelicaST, you who I'm talking about when I say, "if the right person decided to make a e-turbo." Have you considered running a separate alternator hooked to its own battery to supply power? If you could get a belt system working with the turning of the fan, you could run multiple electric motors on it. This would probably be more complicated than making a supercharger, but it would prove a point. Any time you have innovations there are always very reputable skeptics. Skeptics are very important to the advancement of science. They make it so we have to prove everything thoroughly. I deal with them on a daily basis. After dealing with them for so long, it's almost irritating to see the things people say with no proof. People can say and believe anything they want, but the only thing that real is things that are proven. Weather its skeptics or researcher. If the skeptics say this is wrong, I challenge them experiment and prove it is false. If nothing else, provide scientific evidence to back up your theory. The science to this is simple. How much air can an electronically driven fan push? If it's more than a car can take in, it will pressurize. The practicality is the only thing in question in my mind. That is what you are for CelicaST. Please prove this one way or the other.
well thank you. "Have you considered running a separate alternator hooked to its own battery to supply power? If you could get a belt system working with the turning of the fan, you could run multiple electric motors on it." sorry i dont understand the benefit or what you mean by either of those two ideas
and both sound to complicated to the point where it would be more difficult to install than a typical setup. main benefit of such a electronic setup would be installation ease. well when im a senior i hope to, but first i would have to get this project approved by the ME department. sounds like they would since it involves thermodynamics, electronics, fluid dynamics, and pretty much anything else i could think of.oh and this statement "How much air can an electronically driven fan push? If it's more than a car can take in, it will pressurize." is true, however, it will only produce a pressure gradient that the motor can sustain, aka high pressure gradient=high power. a tiny weak motor might pump a lot of air say in open air but once the outlet pressure rises in relation to the inlet pressure, it becomes harder for that motor to pump air in. IN CONCLUSION, dont buy an eturbo! they are scams and a complete waste of money.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 9, 2006 - 5:08 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
This shouldnt even be debated on any level....
Yes its possible in theory to create boost with an electric motor, but for less cost and a simpler setup you can have a working TURBO that is using waste energy anyway....
Yes its possible in theory to create boost with an electric motor, but for less cost and a simpler setup you can have a working TURBO that is using waste energy anyway....
AIM : FAQdaWorld
ok, i'm gana say this only one because i know people are gana say i'm full of it because they just dont know, you would be very suprised how much air that little thing can push, I was, I put one on my car for like a week just to see if it would work and it did give gains. probably 10-15 low end hp.
I know its a very cheap way to gain hp and the only reason i bought and installed one was to see if it worked, but I gata tell its the lowest cost part to give the gains it did, and wile its not upgradable some people just want a little extra power. The drain on my battery was considerable but not enough to where i could not continue use indefinetly. in reallity its just like people who put on a CAI, what all does a CAI do really, just takes in air a little better then a stock intake, does not give respectable gains to a motor, so please keep an open mind when it comes to car mods, and dont think that just because something looks like it cant work does not mean it cant.
as far as dyno results i was going to have it tested but sold the part before I got to.
I know its a very cheap way to gain hp and the only reason i bought and installed one was to see if it worked, but I gata tell its the lowest cost part to give the gains it did, and wile its not upgradable some people just want a little extra power. The drain on my battery was considerable but not enough to where i could not continue use indefinetly. in reallity its just like people who put on a CAI, what all does a CAI do really, just takes in air a little better then a stock intake, does not give respectable gains to a motor, so please keep an open mind when it comes to car mods, and dont think that just because something looks like it cant work does not mean it cant.
as far as dyno results i was going to have it tested but sold the part before I got to.
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Are you guessing as to these gains or did you attempt to measure them somehow?
QUOTE(creis @ Feb 10, 2006 - 2:22 PM) [snapback]391869[/snapback]
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I put one on my car for like a week just to see if it would work and it did give gains. probably 10-15 low end hp.
I put one on my car for like a week just to see if it would work and it did give gains. probably 10-15 low end hp.
Are you guessing as to these gains or did you attempt to measure them somehow?
QUOTE(lagos @ Jul 10, 2006 - 1:55 PM) [snapback]454118[/snapback]i know your trying to do the right thing for your motor, but this is one of those times where you should just trust the guys who have had their swaps for a while and have done a ton of research into this.
Come on Jay. You know the butt dyno totally pwns the Dynojet.
Project ST204.5 99.88946% complete...
if it really did add 10-15hp, you would have kept it on the car. only reason people resell stuff like that is because its worthless.
15PSI - 30MPG - Megasquirt Tuned
creis, I knew your post would look bad. You claimed 10-15hp, and you do the famous, "I never got around to dynoing it" line. I'm open to conversation on these e-turboes, but that just opened up the door for the skeptics to bash. Please edit your topic or something. If you support, that's good, but don't claim without evidence. It actaully makes e-turboes look worse to have claims with no real data.
EDIT: I know you mean well, and so do guys like Jay and Lagos who keep us all in check. I really do appreciate the desire to see prove guys, and thanks for not getting too mean on this thread. Presure2, thanks to you too. I know you guys don't mean to be mean, I know your just trying to help.
This post has been edited by Bigmeanbulldog55: Feb 10, 2006 - 5:45 PM
EDIT: I know you mean well, and so do guys like Jay and Lagos who keep us all in check. I really do appreciate the desire to see prove guys, and thanks for not getting too mean on this thread. Presure2, thanks to you too. I know you guys don't mean to be mean, I know your just trying to help.
This post has been edited by Bigmeanbulldog55: Feb 10, 2006 - 5:45 PM
Live Free, Be Happy
ok ive thought about this, and i actually think that a 30watt motor could provide a benefit. not by providing boost (although it will provide a miniscule amount), but by eliminating the vaccuum. ok with my 1.8 liter 7a, it will pump around 191 cfm at 6000rpm as i already calculated. the eturbo i sas for sale advertised 250 cfm, which i assume to be correct at a low pressure gradient. like i said, it will create a pressure gradient because of the excess flow, however it will be very small. as ill say again, 30 watts isnt enough power to create significant boost obviously. what i didnt take into account is that typically the pressure in the intake manifold is about around 1psi or more less than atmospheric due to flow restriction in the intake. so, as long as the motor is powerful enough to flow more air through the filter than the engine requires, it SHOULD result in a slight performance gain.
and FAQ, i have to disagree. if a proper electric setup was mass-produced, it could be cheaper or at least similarly priced (only difference really would be etubo instead of turbo, and a high discharge alternator instead of custom exhaust manifold/downpipe), and it would be a little easier to install (no exhaust modification, oil lines to hookup). yes i know it wont be as thermodynamically efficient as a turbo, but it should be somewhat comparable to a supercharger. main advantages again would be installation, controlability, reliability. remember, the smaller motor the easier this would be. my 1.8 7a with a 300amp alt is still on the lower end of performance (although it would work). and with a 2.2 5s, your looking at an even higher power alt/motor required. time to crack open the books and do some hard calculations
and FAQ, i have to disagree. if a proper electric setup was mass-produced, it could be cheaper or at least similarly priced (only difference really would be etubo instead of turbo, and a high discharge alternator instead of custom exhaust manifold/downpipe), and it would be a little easier to install (no exhaust modification, oil lines to hookup). yes i know it wont be as thermodynamically efficient as a turbo, but it should be somewhat comparable to a supercharger. main advantages again would be installation, controlability, reliability. remember, the smaller motor the easier this would be. my 1.8 7a with a 300amp alt is still on the lower end of performance (although it would work). and with a 2.2 5s, your looking at an even higher power alt/motor required. time to crack open the books and do some hard calculations
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
>
Please explain how the reduction of the vacuum reading (to something less than boost) increases performance. I always understood that at vacuum or 0 the combustion chambers are getting the same air and fuel and flow. Are you saying this is incorrect?
QUOTE(celicaST @ Feb 10, 2006 - 4:53 PM) [snapback]391926[/snapback]
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ok ive thought about this, and i actually think that a 30watt motor could provide a benefit. not by providing boost (although it will provide a miniscule amount), but by eliminating the vaccuum. ok with my 1.8 liter 7a, it will pump around 191 cfm at 6000rpm as i already calculated. the eturbo i sas for sale advertised 250 cfm, which i assume to be correct at a low pressure gradient. like i said, it will create a pressure gradient because of the excess flow, however it will be very small. as ill say again, 30 watts isnt enough power to create significant boost obviously. what i didnt take into account is that typically the pressure in the intake manifold is about around 1psi or more less than atmospheric due to flow restriction in the intake. so, as long as the motor is powerful enough to flow more air through the filter than the engine requires, it SHOULD result in a slight performance gain.
and FAQ, i have to disagree. if a proper electric setup was mass-produced, it could be cheaper or at least similarly priced (only difference really would be etubo instead of turbo, and a high discharge alternator instead of custom exhaust manifold/downpipe), and it would be a little easier to install (no exhaust modification, oil lines to hookup). yes i know it wont be as thermodynamically efficient as a turbo, but it should be somewhat comparable to a supercharger. main advantages again would be installation, controlability, reliability. remember, the smaller motor the easier this would be. my 1.8 7a with a 300amp alt is still on the lower end of performance (although it would work). and with a 2.2 5s, your looking at an even higher power alt/motor required. time to crack open the books and do some hard calculations
ok ive thought about this, and i actually think that a 30watt motor could provide a benefit. not by providing boost (although it will provide a miniscule amount), but by eliminating the vaccuum. ok with my 1.8 liter 7a, it will pump around 191 cfm at 6000rpm as i already calculated. the eturbo i sas for sale advertised 250 cfm, which i assume to be correct at a low pressure gradient. like i said, it will create a pressure gradient because of the excess flow, however it will be very small. as ill say again, 30 watts isnt enough power to create significant boost obviously. what i didnt take into account is that typically the pressure in the intake manifold is about around 1psi or more less than atmospheric due to flow restriction in the intake. so, as long as the motor is powerful enough to flow more air through the filter than the engine requires, it SHOULD result in a slight performance gain.
and FAQ, i have to disagree. if a proper electric setup was mass-produced, it could be cheaper or at least similarly priced (only difference really would be etubo instead of turbo, and a high discharge alternator instead of custom exhaust manifold/downpipe), and it would be a little easier to install (no exhaust modification, oil lines to hookup). yes i know it wont be as thermodynamically efficient as a turbo, but it should be somewhat comparable to a supercharger. main advantages again would be installation, controlability, reliability. remember, the smaller motor the easier this would be. my 1.8 7a with a 300amp alt is still on the lower end of performance (although it would work). and with a 2.2 5s, your looking at an even higher power alt/motor required. time to crack open the books and do some hard calculations
Please explain how the reduction of the vacuum reading (to something less than boost) increases performance. I always understood that at vacuum or 0 the combustion chambers are getting the same air and fuel and flow. Are you saying this is incorrect?
QUOTE(lagos @ Jul 10, 2006 - 1:55 PM) [snapback]454118[/snapback]i know your trying to do the right thing for your motor, but this is one of those times where you should just trust the guys who have had their swaps for a while and have done a ton of research into this.
>
well im sure youre aware that the mechanics of ICE's is extremely complex. NA engines are engineered to maximize the air mass enclosed in the cylinder after the intake valve closes. the timing of the intake valve is tuned to take maximum advantage of the phenomenon where the intake charge acquires a slight pressure to to rapid change in its velocity. this couples with the vacuum created by the pulse of exiting exhaust gases (exhaust scavenging) can actually create hyperbaric conditions in the chamber at certain speeds. now im not entirely sure that eliminating the vacuum would be benefitial, but my gut feeling says it would (i see no reason why it shouldnt trap more air per stroke), and what the hell, it couldnt hurt
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 10, 2006 - 6:31 PM
QUOTE(jgreening @ Feb 10, 2006 - 4:09 PM) [snapback]391935[/snapback]
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>
Please explain how the reduction of the vacuum reading (to something less than boost) increases performance. I always understood that at vacuum or 0 the combustion chambers are getting the same air and fuel and flow. Are you saying this is incorrect?
>
QUOTE(celicaST @ Feb 10, 2006 - 4:53 PM) [snapback]391926[/snapback]
>
ok ive thought about this, and i actually think that a 30watt motor could provide a benefit. not by providing boost (although it will provide a miniscule amount), but by eliminating the vaccuum. ok with my 1.8 liter 7a, it will pump around 191 cfm at 6000rpm as i already calculated. the eturbo i sas for sale advertised 250 cfm, which i assume to be correct at a low pressure gradient. like i said, it will create a pressure gradient because of the excess flow, however it will be very small. as ill say again, 30 watts isnt enough power to create significant boost obviously. what i didnt take into account is that typically the pressure in the intake manifold is about around 1psi or more less than atmospheric due to flow restriction in the intake. so, as long as the motor is powerful enough to flow more air through the filter than the engine requires, it SHOULD result in a slight performance gain.
and FAQ, i have to disagree. if a proper electric setup was mass-produced, it could be cheaper or at least similarly priced (only difference really would be etubo instead of turbo, and a high discharge alternator instead of custom exhaust manifold/downpipe), and it would be a little easier to install (no exhaust modification, oil lines to hookup). yes i know it wont be as thermodynamically efficient as a turbo, but it should be somewhat comparable to a supercharger. main advantages again would be installation, controlability, reliability. remember, the smaller motor the easier this would be. my 1.8 7a with a 300amp alt is still on the lower end of performance (although it would work). and with a 2.2 5s, your looking at an even higher power alt/motor required. time to crack open the books and do some hard calculations
ok ive thought about this, and i actually think that a 30watt motor could provide a benefit. not by providing boost (although it will provide a miniscule amount), but by eliminating the vaccuum. ok with my 1.8 liter 7a, it will pump around 191 cfm at 6000rpm as i already calculated. the eturbo i sas for sale advertised 250 cfm, which i assume to be correct at a low pressure gradient. like i said, it will create a pressure gradient because of the excess flow, however it will be very small. as ill say again, 30 watts isnt enough power to create significant boost obviously. what i didnt take into account is that typically the pressure in the intake manifold is about around 1psi or more less than atmospheric due to flow restriction in the intake. so, as long as the motor is powerful enough to flow more air through the filter than the engine requires, it SHOULD result in a slight performance gain.
and FAQ, i have to disagree. if a proper electric setup was mass-produced, it could be cheaper or at least similarly priced (only difference really would be etubo instead of turbo, and a high discharge alternator instead of custom exhaust manifold/downpipe), and it would be a little easier to install (no exhaust modification, oil lines to hookup). yes i know it wont be as thermodynamically efficient as a turbo, but it should be somewhat comparable to a supercharger. main advantages again would be installation, controlability, reliability. remember, the smaller motor the easier this would be. my 1.8 7a with a 300amp alt is still on the lower end of performance (although it would work). and with a 2.2 5s, your looking at an even higher power alt/motor required. time to crack open the books and do some hard calculations
Please explain how the reduction of the vacuum reading (to something less than boost) increases performance. I always understood that at vacuum or 0 the combustion chambers are getting the same air and fuel and flow. Are you saying this is incorrect?
well im sure youre aware that the mechanics of ICE's is extremely complex. NA engines are engineered to maximize the air mass enclosed in the cylinder after the intake valve closes. the timing of the intake valve is tuned to take maximum advantage of the phenomenon where the intake charge acquires a slight pressure to to rapid change in its velocity. this couples with the vacuum created by the pulse of exiting exhaust gases (exhaust scavenging) can actually create hyperbaric conditions in the chamber at certain speeds. now im not entirely sure that eliminating the vacuum would be benefitial, but my gut feeling says it would (i see no reason why it shouldnt trap more air per stroke), and what the hell, it couldnt hurt
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 10, 2006 - 6:31 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
With the elimiation of the vacum, couldn't this help scavanging? This would help the exhaust pull, pull in more air due to it being readily avalible and not having to "suck" it in. It would just help the flow, I think. Might help these econo heads.
Live Free, Be Happy
ok well i just google eturbo+dyno, some finds:
discussion with possible reported dyno results
this one hes reporting is rated at 55amps (significantly more than the first one i saw at 2.2amp, but isnt continuous due to overheating. as long as the pump can flow more air than your engine is flowing, you WILL generate a pressure gradient (but the magnitude depends on the power of the pump). im convinced with a decently power motor, gains will be seen as long as the parasitic load on the alternator doesnt exceed the extra power generated.
heres the actual site for the eram, eram, theres some vids, testimonials and other stuff. make sure to read FAQ and buyers guide (fraud protection). this thing is legit, 2006 model is a 833watt motor (only activated at WOT), 2006. also on the home page, download and read the pdf file of magazine article dyno testing it on a civic. i might try one and see what its like.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 10, 2006 - 8:50 PM
discussion with possible reported dyno results
this one hes reporting is rated at 55amps (significantly more than the first one i saw at 2.2amp, but isnt continuous due to overheating. as long as the pump can flow more air than your engine is flowing, you WILL generate a pressure gradient (but the magnitude depends on the power of the pump). im convinced with a decently power motor, gains will be seen as long as the parasitic load on the alternator doesnt exceed the extra power generated.
heres the actual site for the eram, eram, theres some vids, testimonials and other stuff. make sure to read FAQ and buyers guide (fraud protection). this thing is legit, 2006 model is a 833watt motor (only activated at WOT), 2006. also on the home page, download and read the pdf file of magazine article dyno testing it on a civic. i might try one and see what its like.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 10, 2006 - 8:50 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
I have one laying around that I will donate if anybody has some dyno time. It basically works like ram air.
Its a boat impellar designed to move air into the cabins through ducting. Lets put it on a dyno to see if it does anything.
Its a boat impellar designed to move air into the cabins through ducting. Lets put it on a dyno to see if it does anything.
heres the dyno of it that the magazine did. on a 95 civic
not bad for $300.
another interesting read, looks like its already produced, although this article is old VTES
this is probably what everybody has in mind when they are discounting the idea, and this sounds what madmods has (or something similar) e-turbo
ok notice on the box this is 3.5amp motor. now of course it didnt do anything, it doesnt matter if it can flow 230cfm in free air, these kids obviously know nothing about physics. this is so much different than the 833 watt eram motor, which by the way, im considering buying soon.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 12, 2006 - 11:01 PM
not bad for $300.
another interesting read, looks like its already produced, although this article is old VTES
this is probably what everybody has in mind when they are discounting the idea, and this sounds what madmods has (or something similar) e-turbo
ok notice on the box this is 3.5amp motor. now of course it didnt do anything, it doesnt matter if it can flow 230cfm in free air, these kids obviously know nothing about physics. this is so much different than the 833 watt eram motor, which by the way, im considering buying soon.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 12, 2006 - 11:01 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
>
For the record, my question about whether you measured in some way was not discounting what you felt. Altough you never had it on a dyno, I was wondering if you estimated these gains some other way (like a simple boost guage, for example). I have a hard time believing these devices could even result in positive boost of 1psi.
Also, is that dyno graph from the vendor or someone who bought one and tested it? It makes a difference.
QUOTE(creis @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:41 PM) [snapback]392797[/snapback]
>
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
For the record, my question about whether you measured in some way was not discounting what you felt. Altough you never had it on a dyno, I was wondering if you estimated these gains some other way (like a simple boost guage, for example). I have a hard time believing these devices could even result in positive boost of 1psi.
Also, is that dyno graph from the vendor or someone who bought one and tested it? It makes a difference.
QUOTE(lagos @ Jul 10, 2006 - 1:55 PM) [snapback]454118[/snapback]i know your trying to do the right thing for your motor, but this is one of those times where you should just trust the guys who have had their swaps for a while and have done a ton of research into this.
>
im purchasing the e-ram tomorrow, and i will post impressions after installation. i encourage everybody to take a look at this product with an open mind. and like you said, it can be better than a conventional set-up. in fact, ive talked to my brother and we are going to build a high power electric forced induction setup (we are beginning to research and want to have it complete by end of 07, if not much earlier). ive given up on the idea of constantly running the motor because of power issues (and it would require an AC inverter and transformers), instead it will be more akin to the eram (activate at WOT), but with more power. we plan on running a 5+hp electric motor with a multi-stage compressor (kind of like a turbofan jet engine's compressors). it will be powered not the car battery or a seperate battery-pack, but by an ultracapacitor. this is what we are looking at using for power supply.
goal is to provide 10psi max boost on a 1.8L engine.
and it will be quicker than any 7afte running 10psi, because there will be no parasitic losses during periods of boost (power from ultracapicors was stored during periods of disuse from the alternator), and no turbo lag.
not to mention this will be very unique.
it will be a mix between the eram and the electric supercharger by thomas knight. we wont be using a roots blower, and we wont require the power that knights does because we are developing for 1.8L engine (but will also work fine on 2.2L). it will only be activated at WOT, but unlike both it will be powered solely by ultracapitors.
QUOTE(creis @ Feb 12, 2006 - 7:41 PM) [snapback]392797[/snapback]
>
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
im purchasing the e-ram tomorrow, and i will post impressions after installation. i encourage everybody to take a look at this product with an open mind. and like you said, it can be better than a conventional set-up. in fact, ive talked to my brother and we are going to build a high power electric forced induction setup (we are beginning to research and want to have it complete by end of 07, if not much earlier). ive given up on the idea of constantly running the motor because of power issues (and it would require an AC inverter and transformers), instead it will be more akin to the eram (activate at WOT), but with more power. we plan on running a 5+hp electric motor with a multi-stage compressor (kind of like a turbofan jet engine's compressors). it will be powered not the car battery or a seperate battery-pack, but by an ultracapacitor. this is what we are looking at using for power supply.
goal is to provide 10psi max boost on a 1.8L engine.
and it will be quicker than any 7afte running 10psi, because there will be no parasitic losses during periods of boost (power from ultracapicors was stored during periods of disuse from the alternator), and no turbo lag.
not to mention this will be very unique.
it will be a mix between the eram and the electric supercharger by thomas knight. we wont be using a roots blower, and we wont require the power that knights does because we are developing for 1.8L engine (but will also work fine on 2.2L). it will only be activated at WOT, but unlike both it will be powered solely by ultracapitors.
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
well the anser is no it was not tested other then feel.
It is however holding your had over the outlest end wile its running was a good way to tell it pushes a lot of air. also I dont know if you guys have seen the fan blade on it, its not a conventional propeller that has massive restriction because the motor is in the way, its a rotary kinda fan (probably using the rong turm but its a fan that pushes the air horazontaly from the fans center so there is no restriction of the motor, and has a good 30 blades on it verticly from the center.
It is however holding your had over the outlest end wile its running was a good way to tell it pushes a lot of air. also I dont know if you guys have seen the fan blade on it, its not a conventional propeller that has massive restriction because the motor is in the way, its a rotary kinda fan (probably using the rong turm but its a fan that pushes the air horazontaly from the fans center so there is no restriction of the motor, and has a good 30 blades on it verticly from the center.
>
did you read the magazine review? S3 mag review of e-ram
i just dont understand why some of you are so in disbelief that this is possible and actually has a lot of promise. the e-ram is a 833 watt (a little over 1hp) motor forcing air into your intake. this isnt going to provide extraordinary gains, but it will provide gains nonetheless.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 12, 2006 - 10:17 PM
QUOTE(jgreening @ Feb 12, 2006 - 7:48 PM) [snapback]392800[/snapback]
>
>
For the record, my question about whether you measured in some way was not discounting what you felt. Altough you never had it on a dyno, I was wondering if you estimated these gains some other way (like a simple boost guage, for example). I have a hard time believing these devices could even result in positive boost of 1psi.
Also, is that dyno graph from the vendor or someone who bought one and tested it? It makes a difference.
>
QUOTE(creis @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:41 PM) [snapback]392797[/snapback]
>
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
I know my statement sounded kinda bad, "never got around to it" kinda thing but its true I do stand behind it pushing 10-15 (probably more tward 10, but I cant back that up, its just what i felt it push. The only dyno I know of thats worth going to is 40 miles south, and I had no free time for that.
basicly all the thing was, is a fan, powered by a elecctric RC motor, now for thoes that dont know, RC motors can run Extreamly fast with minimal current.
in reality all a reg turbo is, is a fan pushing air into the motor, the fact that its powerd by the exhaust or a batt really makes no diff (with the exception that a reg turbo spools up and then helps pull the exhaust as well.) thinking about it, the idea of an electronic turbo could (maybe) be better in that if you can push enough air with the fan to create boost you would have far more control over your motors HP output because you can easaly change how much boost you want and when, with a very simple system.
Side note: I'm not saying some cheap turbo would ever be as good as a reg turbo, but just dont think it can do nothing for your motor.
For the record, my question about whether you measured in some way was not discounting what you felt. Altough you never had it on a dyno, I was wondering if you estimated these gains some other way (like a simple boost guage, for example). I have a hard time believing these devices could even result in positive boost of 1psi.
Also, is that dyno graph from the vendor or someone who bought one and tested it? It makes a difference.
did you read the magazine review? S3 mag review of e-ram
i just dont understand why some of you are so in disbelief that this is possible and actually has a lot of promise. the e-ram is a 833 watt (a little over 1hp) motor forcing air into your intake. this isnt going to provide extraordinary gains, but it will provide gains nonetheless.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 12, 2006 - 10:17 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
Live Free, Be Happy
^ I'v read that, I was not impressed, the thing is kinda a crapy design as far as the fan goes, but 10hp is respectable.
>
ok lets get this straight once and for all. it doesnt matter how much the air a fan can push in unrestricted air(so holding your hand in front of it isnt going to be a good indication if it will be helpful). like the article i posted above witht the kids trying to use a marine blower. it might be able to blow 250 CFM in free air, but it wont be able to produce a significant pressure gradient becuase its only rated at 3.5amps (approx 42watts). imagine placing the output of a fan (or any compressor whether it be a displacement type or cetrifugal) to a closed container. as pressure builds, the air is trying to push its way out against the fan. the fan rpm will slow as pressure builds. it requires a high power fan and a properly desinged housing/compressor to maintain a significant pressure gradient.
>
why arent you impressed? an axial fan has no inherent disadvange of a centrifugal fan. 10hp for 300 bucks is nice value in my opinion.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 12, 2006 - 11:01 PM
QUOTE(creis @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:15 PM) [snapback]392813[/snapback]
>
well the anser is no it was not tested other then feel.
It is however holding your had over the outlest end wile its running was a good way to tell it pushes a lot of air. also I dont know if you guys have seen the fan blade on it, its not a conventional propeller that has massive restriction because the motor is in the way, its a rotary kinda fan (probably using the rong turm but its a fan that pushes the air horazontaly from the fans center so there is no restriction of the motor, and has a good 30 blades on it verticly from the center.
well the anser is no it was not tested other then feel.
It is however holding your had over the outlest end wile its running was a good way to tell it pushes a lot of air. also I dont know if you guys have seen the fan blade on it, its not a conventional propeller that has massive restriction because the motor is in the way, its a rotary kinda fan (probably using the rong turm but its a fan that pushes the air horazontaly from the fans center so there is no restriction of the motor, and has a good 30 blades on it verticly from the center.
ok lets get this straight once and for all. it doesnt matter how much the air a fan can push in unrestricted air(so holding your hand in front of it isnt going to be a good indication if it will be helpful). like the article i posted above witht the kids trying to use a marine blower. it might be able to blow 250 CFM in free air, but it wont be able to produce a significant pressure gradient becuase its only rated at 3.5amps (approx 42watts). imagine placing the output of a fan (or any compressor whether it be a displacement type or cetrifugal) to a closed container. as pressure builds, the air is trying to push its way out against the fan. the fan rpm will slow as pressure builds. it requires a high power fan and a properly desinged housing/compressor to maintain a significant pressure gradient.
>
QUOTE(creis @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:23 PM) [snapback]392823[/snapback]
>
^ I'v read that, I was not impressed, the thing is kinda a crapy design as far as the fan goes, but 10hp is respectable.
^ I'v read that, I was not impressed, the thing is kinda a crapy design as far as the fan goes, but 10hp is respectable.
why arent you impressed? an axial fan has no inherent disadvange of a centrifugal fan. 10hp for 300 bucks is nice value in my opinion.
This post has been edited by celicaST: Feb 12, 2006 - 11:01 PM
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
>
why would engine run bad while not boosting? i assumer youre talking about restriction of compressor blades. well if properly designed it should not provide a large restriction. however it will be more restrictive, and since we dont want a really slow car under normal driving, were planning on powering the motor continuosly from alternator(at a lower power) during normal driving (to provide around 0.5-1psi of boost). we thought of using a bypass valve, but thought the other idea to be much better and simpler. i dont get what your trying to say about timing.
QUOTE(Bigmeanbulldog55 @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:22 PM) [snapback]392822[/snapback]
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Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
why would engine run bad while not boosting? i assumer youre talking about restriction of compressor blades. well if properly designed it should not provide a large restriction. however it will be more restrictive, and since we dont want a really slow car under normal driving, were planning on powering the motor continuosly from alternator(at a lower power) during normal driving (to provide around 0.5-1psi of boost). we thought of using a bypass valve, but thought the other idea to be much better and simpler. i dont get what your trying to say about timing.
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
If it is possible to hook up some kind of boost gauge (or something else to measure the the output) to these eTurbo's, i'd be glad too try it out on mine...
Let me know...
~snap
This post has been edited by snapshotgt: Feb 12, 2006 - 10:42 PM
Let me know...
~snap
This post has been edited by snapshotgt: Feb 12, 2006 - 10:42 PM
Past: V6 Swapped 6G Celica, E46 BMW M3, Jeep Wrangler TJCurrent: 850rwhp C6 Corvette Grandsport, Gen1 6.2L Ford Raptor
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how powerful is your motor in your eturbo?
QUOTE(snapshotgt @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:39 PM) [snapback]392838[/snapback]
>
If it is possible to hook up some kind of boost gauge (or something else to measure the the output) to these eTurbo's, i'd be glad too...
Let me know...
~snap
If it is possible to hook up some kind of boost gauge (or something else to measure the the output) to these eTurbo's, i'd be glad too...
Let me know...
~snap
how powerful is your motor in your eturbo?
I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.
>
No, I'm talking about how the car adjusts the the amount of air going through it. I just figured it would screw it up to have the on and off again high levels of boost. I think it's more than workable on low levels, but I don't know about high levels. It just seems like it would run weird. I don't know though.
QUOTE(celicaST @ Feb 12, 2006 - 10:38 PM) [snapback]392836[/snapback]
>
>
why would engine run bad while not boosting? i assumer youre talking about restriction of compressor blades. well if properly designed it should not provide a large restriction. however it will be more restrictive, and since we dont want a really slow car under normal driving, were planning on powering the motor continuosly from alternator(at a lower power) during normal driving (to provide around 0.5-1psi of boost). we thought of using a bypass valve, but thought the other idea to be much better and simpler. i dont get what your trying to say about timing.
>
QUOTE(Bigmeanbulldog55 @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:22 PM) [snapback]392822[/snapback]
>
Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
why would engine run bad while not boosting? i assumer youre talking about restriction of compressor blades. well if properly designed it should not provide a large restriction. however it will be more restrictive, and since we dont want a really slow car under normal driving, were planning on powering the motor continuosly from alternator(at a lower power) during normal driving (to provide around 0.5-1psi of boost). we thought of using a bypass valve, but thought the other idea to be much better and simpler. i dont get what your trying to say about timing.No, I'm talking about how the car adjusts the the amount of air going through it. I just figured it would screw it up to have the on and off again high levels of boost. I think it's more than workable on low levels, but I don't know about high levels. It just seems like it would run weird. I don't know though.
Live Free, Be Happy
>
why would it screw it up? the engine management responds to incoming data in milliseconds. even conventional turbocharged cars arent always at high boost (or boost at all). i assume youve seen a boost gauge on a turbo car theyre not always at max boost. keep in mind, with our setup we likewise are going to need fuel system upgrades, fuel management, and a intercooler.
QUOTE(Bigmeanbulldog55 @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:42 PM) [snapback]392843[/snapback]
>
>
No, I'm talking about how the car adjusts the the amount of air going through it. I just figured it would screw it up to have the on and off again high levels of boost. I think it's more than workable on low levels, but I don't know about high levels. It just seems like it would run weird. I don't know though.
>
QUOTE(celicaST @ Feb 12, 2006 - 10:38 PM) [snapback]392836[/snapback]
>
>
why would engine run bad while not boosting? i assumer youre talking about restriction of compressor blades. well if properly designed it should not provide a large restriction. however it will be more restrictive, and since we dont want a really slow car under normal driving, were planning on powering the motor continuosly from alternator(at a lower power) during normal driving (to provide around 0.5-1psi of boost). we thought of using a bypass valve, but thought the other idea to be much better and simpler. i dont get what your trying to say about timing.
>
QUOTE(Bigmeanbulldog55 @ Feb 12, 2006 - 8:22 PM) [snapback]392822[/snapback]
>
Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
Wouldn't it be hard to run 10psi due to the engine running bad when not boosting? The timing would be hard to figure I imagin.
why would engine run bad while not boosting? i assumer youre talking about restriction of compressor blades. well if properly designed it should not provide a large restriction. however it will be more restrictive, and since we dont want a really slow car under normal driving, were planning on powering the motor continuosly from alternator(at a lower power) during normal driving (to provide around 0.5-1psi of boost). we thought of using a bypass valve, but thought the other idea to be much better and simpler. i dont get what your trying to say about timing.No, I'm talking about how the car adjusts the the amount of air going through it. I just figured it would screw it up to have the on and off again high levels of boost. I think it's more than workable on low levels, but I don't know about high levels. It just seems like it would run weird. I don't know though.
why would it screw it up? the engine management responds to incoming data in milliseconds. even conventional turbocharged cars arent always at high boost (or boost at all). i assume youve seen a boost gauge on a turbo car
theyre not always at max boost. keep in mind, with our setup we likewise are going to need fuel system upgrades, fuel management, and a intercooler.I think Bigfoot is blurry, that's the problem. It's not the photographer's fault. Bigfoot is blurry. And that's extra scary to me, because there's a large, out-of-focus monster roaming the countryside.